Hey Balloil..Yuh Guyanese! Who wrote This here!? MaaaN!
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BallOil
- Posts: 19409
- Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:12 pm
Interesting stuff...as you know each story has 3 sides.. 
I doh like to get in to politics but.......
Who killed Walter Rodney..et al ? Was his killing brought to justice?
Guyana divided by the Brits and continued with Burnham and Jagan... All the Governments fatten their wallets I would guess NOT just one... Why the author didn't compare this current Gov't to Burnham's? How much money Burnham had in his Swiss acct while the people of Guyana couldn't get basics stuff like Flour and cooking oil, etc? What did Burnham champion?
Obviously the author has some agendas...
Man, I leff that place 25 years ago...but Caribbean peeps can't run/manage shyte but to the ground...
see why I doh like politics..its a game to fool the masses ..
I doh like to get in to politics but.......
Who killed Walter Rodney..et al ? Was his killing brought to justice?
Guyana divided by the Brits and continued with Burnham and Jagan... All the Governments fatten their wallets I would guess NOT just one... Why the author didn't compare this current Gov't to Burnham's? How much money Burnham had in his Swiss acct while the people of Guyana couldn't get basics stuff like Flour and cooking oil, etc? What did Burnham champion?
Obviously the author has some agendas...
Man, I leff that place 25 years ago...but Caribbean peeps can't run/manage shyte but to the ground...
see why I doh like politics..its a game to fool the masses ..
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BallOil
- Posts: 19409
- Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:12 pm
Wiki
Where was the author when this was going on and did he write against it?
the sad thing about this is that Third world will always play catch up ....but never get there..
Man is not even safe in their own house and at the mercy of Burnham's law.... What is so different from the Death squad?Burhnam at first pursued moderate policies. However, one of his first acts upon independence was a sweeping "National Security Act" giving the police the power to search, seize and arrest anyone virtually at will.
Where was the author when this was going on and did he write against it?
the sad thing about this is that Third world will always play catch up ....but never get there..
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mapoui
- Posts: 8507
- Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:07 pm
yu did not read the question did yu? or you did not understand it?
who wrote it...that was the question?
if no one claims it why should it be taken serious enough to reply to it as you have done?
if there is no author it cannot be taken seriously. and any comments from you ought to be, if you choose to comment i.e..... is whether there is any validity to the claimed events in the article on the ground in Guyana.
that actually is what I was looking for..some comment as to the credibility of the claimed events.
normally URUKNET the publisher of the article is a credible source. and although they attached a disclaimer to it...if no one has the courage to attach a name to it why would they publish it at all?
who wrote it...that was the question?
if no one claims it why should it be taken serious enough to reply to it as you have done?
if there is no author it cannot be taken seriously. and any comments from you ought to be, if you choose to comment i.e..... is whether there is any validity to the claimed events in the article on the ground in Guyana.
that actually is what I was looking for..some comment as to the credibility of the claimed events.
normally URUKNET the publisher of the article is a credible source. and although they attached a disclaimer to it...if no one has the courage to attach a name to it why would they publish it at all?
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mapoui
- Posts: 8507
- Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:07 pm
anyhow ...I dont see too much difference between any people in the world balloil.
all humans are shaped by social experience and environmental and evolutionary pressures. thats all! we give ourselves too much credit...made by god and all dat nonsense!
guyana has had a particular experience that shaped its people. they are the results of that currently. if those conditions do not change basically, even if the power relations change making the last first and the first last, if the old way prevails, whoever it is now first.... are doomed to repeat what they came out of.
they dont know anything better and are suffused with vengenence and so on!
every formerly colonised nation since the age of independence began and ended, have not revolutionised their social life, but took on the very system that enslaved them.... and all have repeated the very same systematic process out of which they came....often having fought hard wars of independence against ole marse'
look around you and see! in every westindian, african and asian country now sport old colony-type colonial administrations that run their countires, on the direction of the IMF, the World Bank, GATT, the american free trade agreements, the african ones..the asian ones.
in every case these rules maintain those formley colonised countries as colonies, without the firect administrative colonial control of the old days. that is not needed anymore. every such nation squeezes the shit out its people to feed international bankers. everything is privatised, all social safety nets destroyed.
there is not a central bank among them all that is actually owned by the people, and functions in the interest of those nations. through those central banks the various economies and credit systems of all formerly colonial nations are controlled. not one of them control their own currencies, which are used against them to build up massive national debt, that enslaves their people permanently...as effectivey, as comprehensively as old slavery.
only the form and nature of the violence has changed. there is no more slavemaster with whip... and the slaves can live and work where they can find work and shelter the violence is now a multifaceted thing that spans the very expensive....made in the west food...the people get to eat, that poisons them. the carcinogenic household and personal products they are propagandised to buy as lifestyle choices...rotten self-deluding educational content...health systems that kill...imported medications that do the same....infected with deseases that are destined to reduce their populations by vast numbers....
and to top it off the administratin of all these nations featuring electoral politics, representative systems, one man one vote etc.... return to office, from any and all of the political parties alive and kicking.... are nothing if they are not analagous or contigous with the old colonial regime.
all that has changed is the face of the ole marse in the region from white to blac and brown. ole marse having found a way to cut his costs, max out profit and control indirectly, from afar...does exacty that...while his coloured proxies now to the dirty work for a price they are satisfied with..the colonial seats. the old governors mansion is now the prime ministers residence.
as in the westindies the guys who fought for the indpendence were ordinary guys not the professional blac and bronw people who had gained position under the old colonial adminsitration by sucking up. they were already an elite ny independence and could be counted on to frustrate any nationalist developments and movements. so the radical, ordinary guys went around them.
but with independence theses elites are the guys who ended up with the local power and killed the chances for a radicalisation of the independent life of the region and nations, by selling out immediatly to ole marse in the new way he sought controll.
in that way the westindian elite has established in the westindies the life they know, the life that fed them, housed and clothed them from the start, by the sucking up.
if that is what they know, what is in their interest....what they had been and are.... what else could have been be expected from them, other than what they have actually done?
look at how Nelson Mandella and the ANC have done the very same thing in South Africa and the consequences to the South African people, who suffer horribly now......after a long hard war against apartheid....far worse than the people of the westindies.
and I kow the westindian people well...all of them including guyanese..indians, blacs, white, mixed...and for the most part they are all of a subservient bent, totally convinced of their inferiority, in love with the white skin, and all with a hair-triger antagonism to their fellow westindians. this is particualrly bad among africans and between africans and indians.
in fact westindians all are far worse than I have described. we must never forget our social provenance includes genocide, slavery, indenture, piracy...the very original examples of this in human history. I mean the indigenous people were wiped out. deliberately, calculatedly. same thing with the institution of slavery, of piracy...which was a deliberate and very brutal form of state crime and undeclared warfare by the british in particular, against the french and spanish!
then there was the Haitian war of independence/the slave war that has resulted in 200 years of penalties against the Haitian people from the white world. and this is how that ends apparently, in the direct take- over by the americans of the haitian reality in the aftermath of a natural disaster, with mass murderer and all round devil Bill Clinton as viceroy, in full bore genocidal intent, effect and impact on current Haiti.
we had Gairy, Burnham and Bird. and now we can add Bharat Jagdeo and his administration to the list of westindian horrors...the westindian horror story...continues!
westindian history is a horror story! such past horror made the current horror possible, made it reality. the Hatian story is the only positive I can think of at this time as precendent for a better situation in the westindies. and we can see what the white west is doing to that legacy at the moment.
westindian situation is an awful, rabid story..its current reality viral and getting worse. the only hope for the westindies as it is the only hope for the whole world, is that ordinary people get up, come out into the strets and end the current global status quo, mash it up, destroy it permanetly, while democratising global social reality. human survival lies directly and only in the democraic forms of social organisation the people in revolution create to distribute the stage of the day, consume it in meeting general social needs, and clear the way for forward movement, minus all the nasty social garbage we have arrived at this final, monopolistic stage of capitalism with.
only in the recognition of this by all and the implementation of real democracy can all the nasty baggage be jettisoned...the racism and general social exploitation of humanity, constant warfare and the genocides, the pillaging of nature that results in catastrophes like the amargeddonish oil disaster in the Gulf of Mexico... the polluting of vast areas of the middle east and central europe with depleted uranium from american bombs..filling up the oceans with the indestructible garbage of capitalist activity like empty plastic water bottles...and on and on and on....
it may be too late already and probably beyond westindian ability now to build a decent society, so deeply imbeded is all the nagative behaviour we have been conditiond by for so long now.
to be honest however I do know what is unfolding in Guyana..what has unfolded...is a repeat and a reversal of the Burnham years. we did not need that unsigned artcle to tell us that. but this is par for the westindian course and exposes the general folishness and hypocrissy that is part and parcel of westindian life.
we never tell ourselves truth and seek to do what is right in our conditions. we prefer to cloak oursleves in every formation of beliefe thast has existed, as well as he new fly-by night ones that pass by. the westindian people are as violent or more so than most people in the world. yet we believe we are a fete loving, party-going, calypso, chutney, reggae, spouge, ragga' soca, soca loving docile gentle people...one of the great hypocrissies of our time.
if the westindian elite were a real nationalist elite they would have acted earlier to curb Burnham, to change his politics. in fact were they so Burnham as dictator could not possibly have happened. and as Burnham happened, had hey learned in the interim, they would have been working with jagdeo from the start to ensure that no reversal and repeat took place...by a positive investment in guyana and regional integration that led the whole westindies in a postive direction.
but the westindian elite is now, still what it was during the Burnham years, probably even worse from obsefrvation of their representative in political power....like Manning in Titty and the guys in Jamiaca and Barbados. we can expect the westindian elite to stand by and watch as they did during Burnhams terror, instead of a postive engagement that finally brings an end to all the horrror in westindin life, starting a new development trend that leads to integration and prosperity
all humans are shaped by social experience and environmental and evolutionary pressures. thats all! we give ourselves too much credit...made by god and all dat nonsense!
guyana has had a particular experience that shaped its people. they are the results of that currently. if those conditions do not change basically, even if the power relations change making the last first and the first last, if the old way prevails, whoever it is now first.... are doomed to repeat what they came out of.
they dont know anything better and are suffused with vengenence and so on!
every formerly colonised nation since the age of independence began and ended, have not revolutionised their social life, but took on the very system that enslaved them.... and all have repeated the very same systematic process out of which they came....often having fought hard wars of independence against ole marse'
look around you and see! in every westindian, african and asian country now sport old colony-type colonial administrations that run their countires, on the direction of the IMF, the World Bank, GATT, the american free trade agreements, the african ones..the asian ones.
in every case these rules maintain those formley colonised countries as colonies, without the firect administrative colonial control of the old days. that is not needed anymore. every such nation squeezes the shit out its people to feed international bankers. everything is privatised, all social safety nets destroyed.
there is not a central bank among them all that is actually owned by the people, and functions in the interest of those nations. through those central banks the various economies and credit systems of all formerly colonial nations are controlled. not one of them control their own currencies, which are used against them to build up massive national debt, that enslaves their people permanently...as effectivey, as comprehensively as old slavery.
only the form and nature of the violence has changed. there is no more slavemaster with whip... and the slaves can live and work where they can find work and shelter the violence is now a multifaceted thing that spans the very expensive....made in the west food...the people get to eat, that poisons them. the carcinogenic household and personal products they are propagandised to buy as lifestyle choices...rotten self-deluding educational content...health systems that kill...imported medications that do the same....infected with deseases that are destined to reduce their populations by vast numbers....
and to top it off the administratin of all these nations featuring electoral politics, representative systems, one man one vote etc.... return to office, from any and all of the political parties alive and kicking.... are nothing if they are not analagous or contigous with the old colonial regime.
all that has changed is the face of the ole marse in the region from white to blac and brown. ole marse having found a way to cut his costs, max out profit and control indirectly, from afar...does exacty that...while his coloured proxies now to the dirty work for a price they are satisfied with..the colonial seats. the old governors mansion is now the prime ministers residence.
as in the westindies the guys who fought for the indpendence were ordinary guys not the professional blac and bronw people who had gained position under the old colonial adminsitration by sucking up. they were already an elite ny independence and could be counted on to frustrate any nationalist developments and movements. so the radical, ordinary guys went around them.
but with independence theses elites are the guys who ended up with the local power and killed the chances for a radicalisation of the independent life of the region and nations, by selling out immediatly to ole marse in the new way he sought controll.
in that way the westindian elite has established in the westindies the life they know, the life that fed them, housed and clothed them from the start, by the sucking up.
if that is what they know, what is in their interest....what they had been and are.... what else could have been be expected from them, other than what they have actually done?
look at how Nelson Mandella and the ANC have done the very same thing in South Africa and the consequences to the South African people, who suffer horribly now......after a long hard war against apartheid....far worse than the people of the westindies.
and I kow the westindian people well...all of them including guyanese..indians, blacs, white, mixed...and for the most part they are all of a subservient bent, totally convinced of their inferiority, in love with the white skin, and all with a hair-triger antagonism to their fellow westindians. this is particualrly bad among africans and between africans and indians.
in fact westindians all are far worse than I have described. we must never forget our social provenance includes genocide, slavery, indenture, piracy...the very original examples of this in human history. I mean the indigenous people were wiped out. deliberately, calculatedly. same thing with the institution of slavery, of piracy...which was a deliberate and very brutal form of state crime and undeclared warfare by the british in particular, against the french and spanish!
then there was the Haitian war of independence/the slave war that has resulted in 200 years of penalties against the Haitian people from the white world. and this is how that ends apparently, in the direct take- over by the americans of the haitian reality in the aftermath of a natural disaster, with mass murderer and all round devil Bill Clinton as viceroy, in full bore genocidal intent, effect and impact on current Haiti.
we had Gairy, Burnham and Bird. and now we can add Bharat Jagdeo and his administration to the list of westindian horrors...the westindian horror story...continues!
westindian history is a horror story! such past horror made the current horror possible, made it reality. the Hatian story is the only positive I can think of at this time as precendent for a better situation in the westindies. and we can see what the white west is doing to that legacy at the moment.
westindian situation is an awful, rabid story..its current reality viral and getting worse. the only hope for the westindies as it is the only hope for the whole world, is that ordinary people get up, come out into the strets and end the current global status quo, mash it up, destroy it permanetly, while democratising global social reality. human survival lies directly and only in the democraic forms of social organisation the people in revolution create to distribute the stage of the day, consume it in meeting general social needs, and clear the way for forward movement, minus all the nasty social garbage we have arrived at this final, monopolistic stage of capitalism with.
only in the recognition of this by all and the implementation of real democracy can all the nasty baggage be jettisoned...the racism and general social exploitation of humanity, constant warfare and the genocides, the pillaging of nature that results in catastrophes like the amargeddonish oil disaster in the Gulf of Mexico... the polluting of vast areas of the middle east and central europe with depleted uranium from american bombs..filling up the oceans with the indestructible garbage of capitalist activity like empty plastic water bottles...and on and on and on....
it may be too late already and probably beyond westindian ability now to build a decent society, so deeply imbeded is all the nagative behaviour we have been conditiond by for so long now.
to be honest however I do know what is unfolding in Guyana..what has unfolded...is a repeat and a reversal of the Burnham years. we did not need that unsigned artcle to tell us that. but this is par for the westindian course and exposes the general folishness and hypocrissy that is part and parcel of westindian life.
we never tell ourselves truth and seek to do what is right in our conditions. we prefer to cloak oursleves in every formation of beliefe thast has existed, as well as he new fly-by night ones that pass by. the westindian people are as violent or more so than most people in the world. yet we believe we are a fete loving, party-going, calypso, chutney, reggae, spouge, ragga' soca, soca loving docile gentle people...one of the great hypocrissies of our time.
if the westindian elite were a real nationalist elite they would have acted earlier to curb Burnham, to change his politics. in fact were they so Burnham as dictator could not possibly have happened. and as Burnham happened, had hey learned in the interim, they would have been working with jagdeo from the start to ensure that no reversal and repeat took place...by a positive investment in guyana and regional integration that led the whole westindies in a postive direction.
but the westindian elite is now, still what it was during the Burnham years, probably even worse from obsefrvation of their representative in political power....like Manning in Titty and the guys in Jamiaca and Barbados. we can expect the westindian elite to stand by and watch as they did during Burnhams terror, instead of a postive engagement that finally brings an end to all the horrror in westindin life, starting a new development trend that leads to integration and prosperity
Last edited by mapoui on Fri May 21, 2010 7:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
someone hinding behing the keyboard