now I know westindian batting. I saw with my own eyes what good batting is all about.
BRENDAN NASH IS NOWHERE THERE, NOWHERE CLOSE TO GOOD BATTING..THE OTHER END OF THE UNIVERSE FROM GREAT BATTING.
good to near brilliant batting is Richie richardson, Desmond Haynes, Shive. good batting is Larry Gomes, Gus Logie and Dujon...especialy when the chips were down....
Great battingis kanhia, Sobers, lara, Greenidge,Lloyd, the 3 W's
semi-good batting is Adams, Hoops, Sarwan who at times could even have been considered good...Gayle etc.
flawed batting is the realm of Nash..along with such as Devon Smith, Wavel Hinds, Samuels, Stuart Williams, Campbell, etc.
nash is not even as good as most of those! maybe smith! but Nash is not as good as Samuels or Ryan Hinds. so what was the point of going all the way for skansh when he made no postive difference...when 8 times out of 10 westindies needed runs he failed..and scored only when the side made 5-600 plus.
if nash was as good as englands Piertersen or Trott going tobat for him wud have been worthwhile.I could underatand the advantage. we know he white and all dat but we win with him. it is selfih and there is nutten wrong with that.
but why compromise ourselves with a mediocrity just because he is fair -skinned and his parents could pull huge westindian stgrings?
Brendan Nash to play with Doutta Stars
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mapoui
- Posts: 8507
- Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:07 pm
if sknash was really professional, skilled, determined and classy enuff for test cricket the Oz wud not have let him go.
the Oz are not about letting their citizens of class leave or get away from them. the Oz tend to play anyone..any australian... who is good, no matter their racial origins.
if Nash was of any worth at all the Oz would have ncluded him at some level. for example theat OUtta or Dutta team is very glad they got him and deh are right. at that level Nash claerly fits with hsi experience and the quality or level of the game that is played there.
that is why deh are so glad to get him. if Nash was as useful at the test level the Oz wud have been just as happy to include him. but he is not good and I waspissed that the westindies, with the greatest cricket tradition in the game would stoop so low as to include Nash in our team when the Oz did not want him, when he was already a man of 29-30, with no worth-while record.
peoleassumed that because he was Oz he ws boubnd to be good. that is we all gave Oz cricket precendence over westindies cricket...a cicket that had defedted the Oz consistetnly even when we lost to them, for all and every victory by the Oz over the westindies is tainted by cricket theft and the most untrust-worthy officiating. nash had tro be good because he is australian. but he is not and that is why he was not selected by them
the Oz are not about letting their citizens of class leave or get away from them. the Oz tend to play anyone..any australian... who is good, no matter their racial origins.
if Nash was of any worth at all the Oz would have ncluded him at some level. for example theat OUtta or Dutta team is very glad they got him and deh are right. at that level Nash claerly fits with hsi experience and the quality or level of the game that is played there.
that is why deh are so glad to get him. if Nash was as useful at the test level the Oz wud have been just as happy to include him. but he is not good and I waspissed that the westindies, with the greatest cricket tradition in the game would stoop so low as to include Nash in our team when the Oz did not want him, when he was already a man of 29-30, with no worth-while record.
peoleassumed that because he was Oz he ws boubnd to be good. that is we all gave Oz cricket precendence over westindies cricket...a cicket that had defedted the Oz consistetnly even when we lost to them, for all and every victory by the Oz over the westindies is tainted by cricket theft and the most untrust-worthy officiating. nash had tro be good because he is australian. but he is not and that is why he was not selected by them
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mapoui
- Posts: 8507
- Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:07 pm
the question is not why I opposed nash...not against him, or hate him... but totally opposed his selection...but in light of all I have argued here...why are you and so many westindians in favour of Nash?
nash brought little of value with him, nothing I could see..still cant see. nash did not go to the westindies to deliver anything but to take.
we have had him now for 3-4 years...wat are the benefits? willhe stay in the wesindies when his career such as it is is over?
'Roy' went to Oz and nowlives there, works there, invested his life there. but I amnot interested in all that from nash. he can live where he wants tolive. cricket is the thing and have we benefited.
I do not see that we have. nash has come and gone. he used us and he has not left a hil for having passed that way. he has not even left a bump or dent in the road.
so what did you all fight for? what are you all still fighting for?
from a practical standpong Nash passage is a waste of time. so if it is or was not the practical aspect of the issue that was import what aspect was?
nothing but race! I will bet any money that Westdem is Indian, who takes the white side and defnds that against what he surely sees as the blac side of things regardless.
if westdem rallyloved westrindies cricket..all of it not just the Indo input up to now he would see what i have been talking about at a glance. if westdem cared about the Afro place in westindian life he would also have seen what i am alking about easily.
but westdem does not care about Afros and Afro culture in the westindies... our historical experience and conribution to the development of the region. all westdem cares about is the Indo place and the subsidiary white place and Nash whose interloping he supports because he surely sees itr as negating the afro place and position and advancing the Indo one.
there is no doubt in my mind that that is the case with westdem and a lot of the posters on these boards. they are no looking at the whole westindian situation. they do not think of the westindies a s a place inclusive of all but look only to the Indo postion and the advancement of that place even at the expense of all others...esecially of Afros.
that is what is behind all this..all the abuse of me for stating as is my right my case against the seletiuon of nash. no one focuses on my case but impute to me all sorts of motives not stated in what I have said...unaware of the fact that not only the motives they impute but many others may be contained therein...but that it is best to look at the case therefore as stated and deal with that.
but what westdem imputes to me indicates his own position and suggests that what he accuses me of he himself is guilty of
nash brought little of value with him, nothing I could see..still cant see. nash did not go to the westindies to deliver anything but to take.
we have had him now for 3-4 years...wat are the benefits? willhe stay in the wesindies when his career such as it is is over?
'Roy' went to Oz and nowlives there, works there, invested his life there. but I amnot interested in all that from nash. he can live where he wants tolive. cricket is the thing and have we benefited.
I do not see that we have. nash has come and gone. he used us and he has not left a hil for having passed that way. he has not even left a bump or dent in the road.
so what did you all fight for? what are you all still fighting for?
from a practical standpong Nash passage is a waste of time. so if it is or was not the practical aspect of the issue that was import what aspect was?
nothing but race! I will bet any money that Westdem is Indian, who takes the white side and defnds that against what he surely sees as the blac side of things regardless.
if westdem rallyloved westrindies cricket..all of it not just the Indo input up to now he would see what i have been talking about at a glance. if westdem cared about the Afro place in westindian life he would also have seen what i am alking about easily.
but westdem does not care about Afros and Afro culture in the westindies... our historical experience and conribution to the development of the region. all westdem cares about is the Indo place and the subsidiary white place and Nash whose interloping he supports because he surely sees itr as negating the afro place and position and advancing the Indo one.
there is no doubt in my mind that that is the case with westdem and a lot of the posters on these boards. they are no looking at the whole westindian situation. they do not think of the westindies a s a place inclusive of all but look only to the Indo postion and the advancement of that place even at the expense of all others...esecially of Afros.
that is what is behind all this..all the abuse of me for stating as is my right my case against the seletiuon of nash. no one focuses on my case but impute to me all sorts of motives not stated in what I have said...unaware of the fact that not only the motives they impute but many others may be contained therein...but that it is best to look at the case therefore as stated and deal with that.
but what westdem imputes to me indicates his own position and suggests that what he accuses me of he himself is guilty of
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Westdem
- Posts: 4025
- Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 8:54 pm
mapoui wrote:the question is not why I opposed nash...not against him, or hate him... but totally opposed his selection...but in light of all I have argued here...why are you and so many westindians in favour of Nash?
nash brought little of value with him, nothing I could see..still cant see. nash did not go to the westindies to deliver anything but to take.
we have had him now for 3-4 years...wat are the benefits? willhe stay in the wesindies when his career such as it is is over?
'Roy' went to Oz and nowlives there, works there, invested his life there. but I amnot interested in all that from nash. he can live where he wants tolive. cricket is the thing and have we benefited.
I do not see that we have. nash has come and gone. he used us and he has not left a hil for having passed that way. he has not even left a bump or dent in the road.
so what did you all fight for? what are you all still fighting for?
from a practical standpong Nash passage is a waste of time. so if it is or was not the practical aspect of the issue that was import what aspect was?
nothing but race! I will bet any money that Westdem is Indian, who takes the white side and defnds that against what he surely sees as the blac side of things regardless.
if westdem rallyloved westrindies cricket..all of it not just the Indo input up to now he would see what i have been talking about at a glance. if westdem cared about the Afro place in westindian life he would also have seen what i am alking about easily.
but westdem does not care about Afros and Afro culture in the westindies... our historical experience and conribution to the development of the region. all westdem cares about is the Indo place and the subsidiary white place and Nash whose interloping he supports because he surely sees itr as negating the afro place and position and advancing the Indo one.
there is no doubt in my mind that that is the case with westdem and a lot of the posters on these boards. they are no looking at the whole westindian situation. they do not think of the westindies a s a place inclusive of all but look only to the Indo postion and the advancement of that place even at the expense of all others...esecially of Afros.
that is what is behind all this..all the abuse of me for stating as is my right my case against the seletiuon of nash. no one focuses on my case but impute to me all sorts of motives not stated in what I have said...unaware of the fact that not only the motives they impute but many others may be contained therein...but that it is best to look at the case therefore as stated and deal with that.
but what westdem imputes to me indicates his own position and suggests that what he accuses me of he himself is guilty of
Lets agree to disagree but don't throw out false accusation....I would not event entertain your taughts on the Indo/Afro issue...keep talking to yuhself and maybe, just maybe yuh will come to self realization of what the reality is....Can you tell me which player should have played instead of Nash?
You have stated your reasons over and over regarding Nash playing fuh de WI...suh my assumption regarding your feeling is about 99.99% spot on..Aite!
BTW - I have been the only Indo playing fuh a yaardie team since 1997 in Uncle Sam and if I was what yuh are accusing me of, I cannot be a hypocrite this long....not even an expert hypocrite like yuh can survive such LIE this long....
Again, I can tell you with a straight face...Nash served WI cricket well during his short career...both on and off the field and yuh gotta respect a man who exceed his ability playing....the same cannot be said for numerous homegrown players that were overhyped in the past....
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mapoui
- Posts: 8507
- Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:07 pm
yu do not see the whole picture...yu do not have a westindian point of view. if yu did yu would see that the same ridiculous sentiment that allowed nash to play for the westindies is the same attitude that underpins all the failure we have experienced since the blac elites took over the wicb.
it is the same anti-nationalist attiude that hired forrin coahes at millions of dllars per, while refusing to accept that we have the greatest traditions in the history of the game, revolutionised how the game is played and that frpom and on our own resources we could recoup and reserge in the game.
on that same basis we could have looked at what the Oz had developed by copying our game and taking it further, taken out of it what we wanted and ourselves incoprate it in our game, using our own brains and resources. we did not have to throw utterly needed millions at fools and saboteus like Bennet King and John Dyson.
it is that same anti nationalist attitude that sees wicb when it is obvious that we must use westindian coaches go for an suck-up tuype like Gibson ignoring ral independent thingking potebtials with real brains.
it is the ssme atitude that resulted in the hate of Brian Lara duing his last 5 years or so on these cricket boards. Lara was unmercifully attacked, especially on the green-eyed board for doing exactl what shive was praised for when Lara left...for being AtLAS!
compare the treatment for Brendan Nash and the treatment of Lara. all consdieration, even-handedness and democrcy was/is accorded nash while Lara was driven away.
one reason I have no sympathy with Gayles problems at all is that he was pivotal in a sabotage of Lara i the westindies team. he had no consideration for Lara. and by that same token I was stunned to see how solicitous and protective he has been of Nash, his inclusion and happiness in the team.
thats the kind of thing Gayle is. I miss his batting but I am very glad he is no longer Captain. and it is neither here no there if he ever plays for the westindiesd again as far as I am concerned.
it is the same anti-nationalist attiude that hired forrin coahes at millions of dllars per, while refusing to accept that we have the greatest traditions in the history of the game, revolutionised how the game is played and that frpom and on our own resources we could recoup and reserge in the game.
on that same basis we could have looked at what the Oz had developed by copying our game and taking it further, taken out of it what we wanted and ourselves incoprate it in our game, using our own brains and resources. we did not have to throw utterly needed millions at fools and saboteus like Bennet King and John Dyson.
it is that same anti nationalist attitude that sees wicb when it is obvious that we must use westindian coaches go for an suck-up tuype like Gibson ignoring ral independent thingking potebtials with real brains.
it is the ssme atitude that resulted in the hate of Brian Lara duing his last 5 years or so on these cricket boards. Lara was unmercifully attacked, especially on the green-eyed board for doing exactl what shive was praised for when Lara left...for being AtLAS!
compare the treatment for Brendan Nash and the treatment of Lara. all consdieration, even-handedness and democrcy was/is accorded nash while Lara was driven away.
one reason I have no sympathy with Gayles problems at all is that he was pivotal in a sabotage of Lara i the westindies team. he had no consideration for Lara. and by that same token I was stunned to see how solicitous and protective he has been of Nash, his inclusion and happiness in the team.
thats the kind of thing Gayle is. I miss his batting but I am very glad he is no longer Captain. and it is neither here no there if he ever plays for the westindiesd again as far as I am concerned.
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mapoui
- Posts: 8507
- Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:07 pm
I dont care who was availabel for selection instead of sknash. anyone at all as far as I am concerned.
attacking the snash selection I am really attacking the sickness in the westindies soul when it comes to race and skin-colour favouritism. we go on with that shit in the westindies 50 yhears after independence. everywhere it is still strong, especially in jamaica.
and this crap results among so man insults to ourselves...in our preference of anything forrin, people or things..over what we have, what we can do, our own independence and development..the development of our own subjectivity, of our love for ourselves and our own thing, the taking care of ourselves and our own and our place as sacred...the very policies that keeps us alive, would keep our people safe, our children growing, healthy and successful instea... of the mess we now have..crim, delinquency and jails, police and army partolling, no facilities for childrne to play, truncated schools, and mental problems all over the place.
no people who love themselves makes room for a forriner, moves themselves to the side so the forriner can find space, ample room...while allowing the most nasty, short, backward and limiting circumstances of life for their own!
all of that i am saying by my focus on Nash.
I dont care what nash does, what he wants, what he tries to accomplish for himself. as far as I am concerned he is doing for himself all that he must do, is rigfor him to do, proper to do. nash is fine, sane, sufers no no emotional problems from having gorwn up in a dysfunctional society, no probelms of racism, of colonilaism, of being lower class in a rigidly class conscious reality, never having been put down by the system, chased and harrassed by police etc ete etc
.the question is what am I doing for myself, especially since I sufer the consequencs of all those negatioves listed abpove? should I, from such a reality, still living in such a reality be making room for Nash? NOSir!
I ought not to be MAKING ROOM FOR NASH! no matter which of mine is to occupy the space. the space is mine and I am going to give it to one of mine for they need it most and we stand to benefit more from him in is teens or early twenties..as oppsed to a 29-33 year old australian reject
attacking the snash selection I am really attacking the sickness in the westindies soul when it comes to race and skin-colour favouritism. we go on with that shit in the westindies 50 yhears after independence. everywhere it is still strong, especially in jamaica.
and this crap results among so man insults to ourselves...in our preference of anything forrin, people or things..over what we have, what we can do, our own independence and development..the development of our own subjectivity, of our love for ourselves and our own thing, the taking care of ourselves and our own and our place as sacred...the very policies that keeps us alive, would keep our people safe, our children growing, healthy and successful instea... of the mess we now have..crim, delinquency and jails, police and army partolling, no facilities for childrne to play, truncated schools, and mental problems all over the place.
no people who love themselves makes room for a forriner, moves themselves to the side so the forriner can find space, ample room...while allowing the most nasty, short, backward and limiting circumstances of life for their own!
all of that i am saying by my focus on Nash.
I dont care what nash does, what he wants, what he tries to accomplish for himself. as far as I am concerned he is doing for himself all that he must do, is rigfor him to do, proper to do. nash is fine, sane, sufers no no emotional problems from having gorwn up in a dysfunctional society, no probelms of racism, of colonilaism, of being lower class in a rigidly class conscious reality, never having been put down by the system, chased and harrassed by police etc ete etc
.the question is what am I doing for myself, especially since I sufer the consequencs of all those negatioves listed abpove? should I, from such a reality, still living in such a reality be making room for Nash? NOSir!
I ought not to be MAKING ROOM FOR NASH! no matter which of mine is to occupy the space. the space is mine and I am going to give it to one of mine for they need it most and we stand to benefit more from him in is teens or early twenties..as oppsed to a 29-33 year old australian reject
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mapoui
- Posts: 8507
- Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:07 pm
all that si what you ought to see, how you ought to be thinking about the westindies. if the playing field of the world was level then all sorts of exchanges wouldbe possible.
but the field is not level and we are what we are becuse of specific historical experience...experience resulting in specif social conditions which determines what we have to do in order to survive as individuals, cultures and naions.
if we are successful then we level the playing field and we can proceed in equality and deal with such as nash diferently..including the way you deal with him.
but in the process of setting ourselves up we must reconstitutue our subjectivity that has been seriously damaged, compromised by and in that same historical experience which saw us as slaves, indentured, colonials and now still controlled.
entertaining nash as we have is tantamount to treating our illness with another dose of the very illness, this time administered by our own actions and decisions.
what it is is that we have been taught well to hate ourselves, to put the inerest of the dominating forriner even before our own..to defend his rights without limit in our own situaton...a defence that would not be reciprorcated were the situation reversed..we in australia instead.
do that he must pay money and join a local club, fight for a place in the club side, fight through the club competiton and battle for a place in the national side.
thats the process and it always takes time. if at 29 he made it thorugh to the top legitmately I would have less of a case. dat would be the most i could do and would do for nash
but the field is not level and we are what we are becuse of specific historical experience...experience resulting in specif social conditions which determines what we have to do in order to survive as individuals, cultures and naions.
if we are successful then we level the playing field and we can proceed in equality and deal with such as nash diferently..including the way you deal with him.
but in the process of setting ourselves up we must reconstitutue our subjectivity that has been seriously damaged, compromised by and in that same historical experience which saw us as slaves, indentured, colonials and now still controlled.
entertaining nash as we have is tantamount to treating our illness with another dose of the very illness, this time administered by our own actions and decisions.
what it is is that we have been taught well to hate ourselves, to put the inerest of the dominating forriner even before our own..to defend his rights without limit in our own situaton...a defence that would not be reciprorcated were the situation reversed..we in australia instead.
do that he must pay money and join a local club, fight for a place in the club side, fight through the club competiton and battle for a place in the national side.
thats the process and it always takes time. if at 29 he made it thorugh to the top legitmately I would have less of a case. dat would be the most i could do and would do for nash
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Westdem
- Posts: 4025
- Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 8:54 pm
Raas Maps...it looks like Nash drove up yuh blood pressure while he was part of the WI team...
BTW he was deserving of his selection and true fans should appreciate his contribution to WI cricket....
NASH is nat de reason WI cricket is where it is today...suh cut de man some slack...
Man I can't wait fuh his tell it all interview!!!!
BTW he was deserving of his selection and true fans should appreciate his contribution to WI cricket....
NASH is nat de reason WI cricket is where it is today...suh cut de man some slack...
Man I can't wait fuh his tell it all interview!!!!
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mikesiva
- Posts: 19320
- Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 11:30 am
- Location: Watford, Hertfordshire
- Contact:
I have no problem with Nash playing for the West Indies....
If Kevin Pietersen, Jonathan Trott and Eoin Morgan can play for England, then Brendan Nash can play for the Windies. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
Nash played 21 Tests and averages 33 with two centuries. Which of our newbies has stats to compare with those?
It doesn't matter if Australia don't want him. We have to accept reality here, and the reality is that Australia are better than us right now.
Remember when we went Down Under to play the Aussies? If we compare the stats of Brendan Nash and Marcus North in that series, Nash outperformed North. So, it was Australia's loss when they turned their back on Nash, and went for North....
If Kevin Pietersen, Jonathan Trott and Eoin Morgan can play for England, then Brendan Nash can play for the Windies. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
Nash played 21 Tests and averages 33 with two centuries. Which of our newbies has stats to compare with those?
It doesn't matter if Australia don't want him. We have to accept reality here, and the reality is that Australia are better than us right now.
Remember when we went Down Under to play the Aussies? If we compare the stats of Brendan Nash and Marcus North in that series, Nash outperformed North. So, it was Australia's loss when they turned their back on Nash, and went for North....