West Indies Cricket Fans

Rev wrote:What's great about the 40/30 rule is its simplicity
Rev

spot on...just want to see what was in the missing 5%

AFRO wrote:

mikesiva wrote: Afro claims he's not downplaying Philander as a bowler, and then what does he do? Downplay Philander by claiming that Roach is better than him!

A lesson for you, Afro...good fast bowling is not only about how fast you bowl. It's about where you put the ball, and what you do with it, and in the modern game, there's no one who can do that better than Philander. He might bowl at 80-82 mph, but he can make the ball sit up and talk. Did you see those dismissals in the first innings 45 all out by NZ?

Philander is miles better than Roach...you won't find anyone outside of the Caribbean supporting your spurious claims that Roach is a better Test bowler than Philander.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH what a deluded prick!!!.. , for a start ROACH HAD THE BEST STRIKE RATE OF ANY PACER LAST YEAR YOU IDIOT, and now lets look at two common opponants from last year shall we?

PHILANDER

Against England

1st test = 79/1 & 29/1

2nd test= 72/2 & 26/1

3rd test= 48/2 & 30/5


Against Australia

1st test= 103/0

2nd test= 55/2 & 42/2


ROACH

Against England

1st test 108/3 & 60/3

2nd test= 90/2 & 16/0

Against Australia

1st test= 72/3 & 45/2

2nd test= 105/5 & 41/5

3rd test= 71/1 & 40/3

So Roach got MORE WICKETS against those two opponants!! , also Philander only had ONE good innings when he got a 5fer against England, Roach not only has pace but incase your old, worn out eyes missed it HE CAN SWING IT BOTH WAYS AND GET MOVEMENT THROUGH THE AIR TOO, furthermore Philander has yet to bowl in Asia, a place where i believe he will find it most difficult to prosper, unlike Roach who already performed in Sri-lanka ,

But why should i be surprised that an ENGLISH SKUNT is backing a SA pacer ahead of a caribbean one? his dad supports India so i guess it's in the blood!! .

The point of averages is more than just strike rates...it's taking wickets versus runs conceded, and on that basis, Philander is far superior to Roach right now. I notice you conveniently leave out the matches where Roach performed poorly.

That is why this predictor is so much better than the rubbish you spout. You select a handful of matches, and claim that those matches represent the only deciding factor. However, averages cover ALL matches the player has played to date.

Philander has played 13 Tests, and has a phenomenal average of just 17.40! And he has played on a lot of different surfaces....on all grounds in South Africa, on the seaming pitches of NZ, on the hard bouncy tracks of Australia, in the swinging conditions of England...he may well struggle with conditions in the subcontinent, but he won't be the first to do so.

Let's do a proper comparison....

In Tests in England this summer, Philander had the best average of any bowler in the Basil D'Oliveira series:

Philander - 12 wkts @ 23.66

Roach - 8 wkts @ 32.45

Philander outperformed Roach in England...simple!

In Tests against Australia, home and away:

Philander - four Tests, 18 wkts @ 21.88

Roach - six Tests, 26 wkts @ 28.15

Good by Roach, but Philander's stats are outstanding!

Now, on to your comment about playing in the Subcontinent: Roach in the Subcontinent....

Bangladesh - 1 Test - 1 wkt @ 101
India - 1 Test - 2 wkts @ 53
Sri Lanka - 3 Tests - 10 wkts @ 24.50

Roach did well in SL, but not in Bangladesh or India....

As I said before, averages are about assessing performances in ALL conditions.

mikesiva wrote: The point of averages is more than just strike rates...it's taking wickets versus runs conceded, and on that basis, Philander is far superior to Roach right now. I notice you conveniently leave out the matches where Roach performed poorly.

LOL what a dumb, desperate D/CKHEAD!! , Roach has only come of age IN THIS PAST TWELVE MONTHS you idiot, thats why i compared the two players stats from LAST YEAR, when Roach made his debut Philander wasn't even playing test cricket so whats the point of talking about Roach's previous matches? did bring up the stats from Kemar's 'man of the series' performance in sri-lanka? NO, did i mention him beating up NZ last year? NO, so come again,

That is why this predictor is so much better than the rubbish you spout. You select a handful of matches, and claim that those matches represent the only deciding factor. However, averages cover ALL matches the player has played to date.

Like i've said before if it's all about "averages" does that mean Philander is a better player than MACKO was because he has a better average now? and is he better than Steyn right now aswell?

Philander has played 13 Tests, and has a phenomenal average of just 17.40! And he has played on a lot of different surfaces....on all grounds in South Africa, on the seaming pitches of NZ, on the hard bouncy tracks of Australia, in the swinging conditions of England...he may well struggle with conditions in the subcontinent, but he won't be the first to do so.

LOL at this fake skunt already preparing his excuses for when Philander goes to his fathers homeland!! , everyone knows Philander has enjoyed some bowling heavens since he made his debut, so i suggest you get real, until he proves himself all ALL tracks like Kemar has there is no way Vernon is better than him, FULL STOP,

Let's do a proper comparison....

In Tests in England this summer, Philander had the best average of any bowler in the Basil D'Oliveira series:

Philander - 12 wkts @ 23.66

Roach - 8 wkts @ 32.45

Philander outperformed Roach in England...simple!

Philander played ONE MORE TEST than Roach did you stupid pig, and his stats were only boosted by the 5fer in his third test, if you compare Kemar's two tests to Philanders first two Kemar was much better, only injury got in the way of Kemar playing the third test and boosting his wicket tally even further, no doubt he would have got more than four in two innings too,

In Tests against Australia, home and away:

Philander - four Tests, 18 wkts @ 21.88

Roach - six Tests, 26 wkts @ 28.15

Good by Roach, but Philander's stats are outstanding!

LOL again bringing up stats that suit your argument!!, Kemar was only playing his SECOND series when he faced Australia away age 21, thats why comparing their whole stats is rather futile, lets compare what they have both done against common opponants LAST YEAR, and when you do that Kemar comes out on top,

Now, on to your comment about playing in the Subcontinent: Roach in the Subcontinent....

Bangladesh - 1 Test - 1 wkt @ 101
India - 1 Test - 2 wkts @ 53
Sri Lanka - 3 Tests - 10 wkts @ 24.50

Roach did well in SL, but not in Bangladesh or India....

As I said before, averages are about assessing performances in ALL conditions.

He's since gone back to Bang and India and performed brilliantly in the ODI's, so at least he's PROVEN he can bowl in them conditions, meanwhile your man Vernon only has experience on green tops and when the pitch has been more for batting he's struggled!! .

Don't mix apples and oranges - we're talking about Tests here, and Tests alone. Check the title of this thread.

Afro, your constant use of obscenities when your arguments are exploded are indicative of your lower IQ....

When Macko retired, they didn't separate his bowling performances before "he came of age". They looked at ALL his Tests when calculating his average, and he's judged accordingly. The same will be true of Philander and Roach. They will both be judged over ALL the Tests that they have played.

The truth is that Philander has had a very impressive start to his Test career, and he needs to be given credit for that. Whether he can maintain that good start remains to be seen. But it also remains to be seen if Roach can maintain his good start...we've seen him go off the boil before.

And your constant harping about where posters live is funny, when you consider that you have never lived in the Caribbean!

It doesn't matter whether a player has played one or two Tests more than the other...what matters is how these players have performed over ALL Tests. It may well be that Philander's career may take a downward turn in 2013, and Roach's may go upwards, but until that happens, the stats show that Philander is currently a superior bowler to Roach.

A bowler's success is not solely determined by how well they bowl in the Subcontinent. That only really matters to players who come from Subcontinent teams. How often will WI and SA bowlers take part in Tests in the Subcontinent? Not often....

YOu divide a bowler's career in two: Tests in home conditions, and then Tests away (all grounds away - not just the Subcontinent). And so far, Philander is out-performing Roach in all categories.

mikesiva wrote:Don't mix apples and oranges - we're talking about Tests here, and Tests alone. Check the title of this thread.

I was talking about CONDITIONS you fool, please keep up!!,

Afro, your constant use of obscenities when your arguments are exploded are indicative of your lower IQ....

Says the same skunt who couldn't even fathom RAWL LEWIS'S TEST STATS? OK OLD BOY!!

When Macko retired, they didn't separate his bowling performances before "he came of age". They looked at ALL his Tests when calculating his average, and he's judged accordingly. The same will be true of Philander and Roach. They will both be judged over ALL the Tests that they have played.

Again YOU KEEP HARPING ON ABOUT "AVERAGE" so is Philander a better pacer t han Macko because his average is currently better? if not then why is that true where Roach is concerned? AVERAGES DON'T TELL THE FULL STORY,

The truth is that Philander has had a very impressive start to his Test career, and he needs to be given credit for that. Whether he can maintain that good start remains to be seen. But it also remains to be seen if Roach can maintain his good start...we've seen him go off the boil before.

Yes he's had a good start ON GREEN TOPS, put any half decent pacer on the tracks he's bowled on and they'd also get a ton of wickets too imo,

And your constant harping about where posters live is funny, when you consider that you have never lived in the Caribbean!

LOL at this english skunt trying to put me in the same boat as HIM!! , i've got that west indian blood running through my vains old boy and i've stayed TRUE to the region, meanwhile you've spent most of your wukless life in the uk and you was BORN THERE, full stop!! ,

It doesn't matter whether a player has played one or two Tests more than the other...what matters is how these players have performed over ALL Tests. It may well be that Philander's career may take a downward turn in 2013, and Roach's may go upwards, but until that happens, the stats show that Philander is currently a superior bowler to Roach.

Yes it does matter you DUMB IDIOT because the stats suggest if Philander had only played his first two tests just like Roach ROACH'S STATS WOULD HAVE BEEN MUCH BETTER,

A bowler's success is not solely determined by how well they bowl in the Subcontinent. That only really matters to players who come from Subcontinent teams. How often will WI and SA bowlers take part in Tests in the Subcontinent? Not often....

LOL again our english friend is already making excuses for when Vernon goes to daddy's town!! , if you can only bowl in one type of condition then YOU'RE AVERAGE imo regardless of what your stats say,

YOu divide a bowler's career in two: Tests in home conditions, and then Tests away (all grounds away - not just the Subcontinent). And so far, Philander is out-performing Roach in all categories.

Philander is also outperforming Steyn too, DOES THAN MEAN HE'S BETTER THAN STEYN? we've compared how both Roach and Philander did against England and Australia last year and there was only ONE WINNER, Roach, so you keep fooling yourself old boy!!, Roach could be one of the greats, meanwhile Vernon's purple patch will soon be a thing of the past when he hits asia!! .

Just because you're crass and abusive doesn't change the fact that you're in a small minority if you think Roach is a better Test bowler than Philander right now....

As I've said before, in certain conditions Philander is a better bowler in Test cricket than Steyn. You seem to be obsessed with pace, but control and movement is better than pace, and on some pitches, there is no one in Test cricket today who can bowl better than Philander. McGrath and Hadlee were not express pace either, and they were outstanding bowlers in Test cricket....

Here's a poll with a wider range of voters, from England, India and WI fans, and as you can see from the votes, fans are more impressed with the trio of Philander, Steyn and Anderson than any other pacers over the past year:

http://www.cricket-match-special.com/vi ... 25&start=0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Of course, there is one deluded India fan who doesn't rate Philander, but he doesn't rate Roach either!

Roach is fighting it out for fourth place with Siddle...he needs your vote. You're registered there as WindieWeathers, so do log on and give Roach your support - he needs it!

mikesiva wrote:Just because you're crass and abusive doesn't change the fact that you're in a small minority if you think Roach is a better Test bowler than Philander right now....

HOW SO? have you done a survay you wukless LIAR?!! , nope, I DIDN'T THINK SO!!

As I've said before, in certain conditions Philander is a better bowler in Test cricket than Steyn. You seem to be obsessed with pace, but control and movement is better than pace, and on some pitches, there is no one in Test cricket today who can bowl better than Philander. McGrath and Hadlee were not express pace either, and they were outstanding bowlers in Test cricket....

LOL at this dumb idiot picking and choosing "conditions" to suit his argument but yet when it comes to batters tracks HE HAS NOTHING TO SAY!! , a true class act is effective when the track offers nothing, Steyn has done that several times and so has Roach in Sri-lanka and England, Philander has failed to do that thus far therefore the other two are better alround bowlers,

Here's a poll with a wider range of voters, from England, India and WI fans, and as you can see from the votes, fans are more impressed with the trio of Philander, Steyn and Anderson than any other pacers over the past year:

Of course, there is one deluded India fan who doesn't rate Philander, but he doesn't rate Roach either!

Roach is fighting it out for fourth place with Siddle...he needs your vote. You're registered there as WindieWeathers, so do log on and give Roach your support - he needs it!

LOL at Mike still trying to push his run down website on people which only has two members and a dog posting there!! , the new flavour of the month will always get attention, but the facts don't lie, AGAINST ENGLAND AND AUSTRALIA ROACH WAS BETTER, and of all the pacers last year ROACH WAS THE BEST IN THE WORLD, full stop .

Philander wrecks the Windies top order. Now do you see how good he is? Big Vernon is better than any Windies bowler right now.

A top order missing Gayle and Darren Bravo!!!..wow what a great achievement when Roach is bowling at AB and Amla!!

Playing with yourselves is silly except if masturbating.
WICB need to have some kind of set up where other Nations are involved.
Where we can attend their country for exposure to foreign elements and conditions.
Franchise is just a baby step between the carribean.
How about a Twin cities like say, Birmingham and Harare ??
dem bwoys would be at home YET still forrin !